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Post by gemstar on Aug 9, 2006 15:29:36 GMT
There is one thing I CAN comment about in reviewing my 9th harmonic. Saturn is opposed by Jupiter....oddly, I have this aspect in composite with my love-and on the DSC-ASC axis....what is with that?!! Anyway.....in my Natal, Saturn is my sorest spot in my 5th house..it is also conjunct chiron. So.....I find it interesting that Saturn is heavily aspected in the 9th harmonic as well!! Heavy responsibilities throughout life...either taken on by me or essentially, where things tend to lead. A natural leader-yes.....no matter what the venue. Yoga, Tango Club....high school, sorority in college, jobs.....etc....oldest in my family.....always in charge usually....but not because I always choose to be. If something needs to be done or someone must take the lead, inevitably, the heads turn to me....almost like it is a natural flow of some kind. People just think I look like I know what I am doing all the time....I guess. An air of authority perhaps??...(GemStar giggles...). Something similar to that I imagine..... ;D
Back to the 9th Sat-Jupiter opposition....it seems that whatever I desire, I have to wait and wait and wait.....the last to get married amongst my friends....and had the BEST marriage until he took a left turn with his bipolar issues.....will be the last to have children...if that ever happens.....ultimately I have to work the hardest for things....but in the end, feel like I have achieved the highest amongst my peers. It feels like climbing the highest mountains....for each and every goal. Yes, I feel lucky at times.....but no one really knows how much behind the scenes work and sweat/anxiety were exerted!! People tend to see the final result with another person....and often have no clue about that person's journey. Does this make sense?
So...in my 9th chart, MC is conj by Jupiter and Juno.....not too shabby except for that darn Saturn opposition....roots perhaps? A weight? An anchor of sorts.....does Saturn fortify the MC by opposing it? What do you think??
Hugs- GemStar
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Post by samina on Aug 9, 2006 16:25:47 GMT
Cool thread! Gem, that really is interesting how your natal & 9H charts are so nearly on the same ASC/DSC axis. Check out how close the MC & ASC are, too -- that means your 7/8/9 and 1/2/3 houses must be HUGE! And your Juno & Jupiter on your MC -- have you been perceived as in a "couple" very often in your life? It would seem to me that, if this pertains at all to either/both capacity for joy & how one vibes with love & relationship, the world would draw you out very easily into couplehood! Especially with that lovely natal 7th-house Venus & Juno! (BTW, your natal South Node sits squarely on my natal 24Scorp Moon. "Home" ) Blue, look at how much astrological ground your 9H chart covers between your MC & ASC -- it would mean that your 10/11/12 houses are absolutely miniscule, while Leo-Libra expand across the 1-12 houses. What's that all about, do you think? Having your Sun & Moon straddling the Libra MC seems very telling, and so nicely trining both Mars & Saturn, I get a sense of fluidity & ease. But then looking at Mars cnj Saturn I get the feeling of paradox. What's your take? Hmm. In my 9H I've got an Aquarian Moon opposing Leo Saturn, which I would identify with as far as navigating close relationships. But then a nice grand trine helps things out: Mars/Eros in Libra trine Sun/POF in Cancer and Uranus in Aquarius. Definitely reinforcing a paradoxical them of intimacy vs detachment that seems to run through my life, and which I'm navigating now in my current relationship. Will have to ponder the Vertex & Black Moon Lilith on my MC... So, any further insights as to what the 9H really pertains? Here's my own chart:
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Post by gemstar on Aug 9, 2006 17:20:27 GMT
Hello Sami....Boy, I am simply screwing around today on the net...getting nuttin done!!! Yes...rather odd that the ASC is nearly the same and I do not get the MC so close...I am not sure that houses count with the 9th....I am not counting them so much. As far as the Jupiter-Juno conjunction...because it is conj the 9th MC, I pertain it to my career/work. I usually do very well at any job I have worked.....with lots of luck in most cases. Now, I am certainly hoping that my current self-employment stint will also be fortunate! So far so good...but it all will be seen when the project is completed and the check is cashed. IF, I choose to sell this home. As of right now....it is a hard decision. To keep it means I need to find other income....and I doubt I can work for corporate America after branching out on my own. (natal 10th house Pluto conj Uranus) It seems too safe to go back to corporate life....so, who knows. Financial suicide perhaps....OR, the JUPITER MC will pull me out in time!! Perhaps this is another manifestation of Jupiter opposed Saturn. I often feel pushed to the very edge.....of a cliff of sorts.....scared that this is it, the end as I know it and my dreams will not be reality....and then, just as I am on the very brink of falling, something brilliant happens and things turn out more thrilling than I imagined!!! It happens every time....and I can tell that I am near that edge now......yet trying to be calm at the same time. Do you ever feel that way?? Regarding relationships, I feel fortunate with my relationships and people. Couple-dom is something which I take very, very seriously. (Natal Saturn sextile Venus/Nnode). I am not a serial dater-type.....and do not waste my time with someone just to be with someone. Though I dislike being alone, I refuse to settle. Too many people settle and I am not one of those.....When in a relationship, I usually do not have drama or any of that nonsense. I love people and have been told that my way of being is apparent. Ceres is right in there too with the natal 7th house Venus/Nnode/Juno!! Having relationships with all types is very natural feeling to me-and IMPORTANT as well....but I am not identifying with the 9th harmonic planets Uranus/Pluto in that house.....weird. It unsettles me for some reason and I do not understand it.....and to make it more odd, my natal Uranus/Pluto planets fall into my love's natal 7th house!! Further, he has a few planets there in those degrees in his 9th harmonic chart....it is uncanny!! Go figure. (Could you follow that? In my 9th harmonic, Pluto and Uranus are in the technical 7th house...which is not the case in my natal. However, in my synastry with my love, these two planets land in HIS natal 7th house!!) What do you make of your 9th Harmonic Sun being conjuncted by Pars Fortunae in Cancer??? Hugs- GemStar PS-I read somewhere that you should check transits to this chart as well!! Funny thing....As i began my divorce, tr Uranus was conjunct my 9th harmonic Moon!! God knows during that time that there were enough other nasty transits in action but not a Uranus-Moon transit in my natal!! Have you all noticed anything about transits to this 9th harmonic? Does it seem to ring any bells? And...I like your chart posting better than mine...I didn't know how to do the charts-links any better!! Sorry to those who have to fiddle with making mine bigger.....I tried!!
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Post by samina on Aug 9, 2006 20:37:12 GMT
I'm in a chatty mood, too, Gem! LOL I've been writing all afternoon, making headway on my book, but a few minutes to chat here sounds dreamy! Hey, I know what you mean about taking relationships seriously -- I've got Sun trine Venus/NN(/Sun/MC) too! You asked about my 9H Sun cnj POF... I was looking at that and noticed some interesting things: My 9H 03Cancer Sun is also conjunct my Draconic ASC at 04Cancer, which is also exactly conjunct the 04Cancer Sun of the new man in my life, with all that tightly flanked by his 06Cancer Moon/Venus and his 03Cancer Mars. And natally, my sun is at 00 Cancer, my NN at 02 Cancer, my MC at 07Cancer, my Eros at 13Cancer, my Fortuna at 16Cancer... And--wow--upon closer look, this man's name asteroid in my 9H chart is exactly conjunct my natal Eros! - In any event, I so resonate with the Cancerian archetype on so many levels. Melting into that makes me very happy, especially when in a relationship. I know myself so well in that regard -- I definitely lose an inner sense of peace when I move out of that energy. And even in life in general, too... I feel best when being receptive & magnetic in drawing things to me. Interesting how these patterns reveal themselves in so many ways! Here's an interesting article about the 9th, relating it somehow to soul-mate energy. I'm not partial to the concept of soul mates in general, but my world has been recently rocked by this new connection so I'm curious. Any comments on it? I'm still formulating my thoughts... www.aquarius-atlanta.com/aug04/harmonic.shtmlsamina
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Post by samina on Aug 9, 2006 20:46:55 GMT
Well, it would make sense... if the 9th describes the inner soul -- what makes it happy, what it's destiny is -- then it would also reflect something about the mate to that soul, and thusly pertain to love/relationship/marriage.
I started out reading this thread wondering what tied all those pieces together. I think I'm gaining a better grasp of what the gist of the 9th is.
Of course, that says nothing about my ability to understand how to pull all the nuances together! LOL
sam
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Post by gemstar on Aug 9, 2006 20:58:25 GMT
Hello Samina.... Yes...I ran across that article the other day and thought it was interesting! So...I searched the threads here at the Forum and saw that a Ninth Harmonic thread had been started this past June. Somehow I blew past it....perhaps not really knowing what the heck this was about. Thus....thought I should resurrect the thread for everyone so that we all could learn more! That is an amazing plethora of Cancerian contacts....WOW!! JOY is abound for you in those beginning degrees of Cancer!! How cool is that? Like you, I am trying my best to figure out the nuances of how this fits in with the whole scheme of things....what makes sense etc. Truly, it has amazed me that the contacts with a loved one are so obvious with the Ninth Harmonic chart....when you have 360 degrees to choose from, it is really intriguing to see those conjunction contacts!! Anyway....the day has wiggled on for me...not much accomplished I am afraid and I feel terribly guilty. I feel as if I am absorbing too many people's vibes around me....through the ether no less!! The Full Moon tends to increase that energy for me and PLUS, today's is on my Nep-sq-Nep transit....making my feelings all a jumble. Nothing feels clear...ugh. That is why I like to bury my head in this astro-information. It is a distraction of sorts.....and besides, it is always helpful to learn!! Who else has something to add after reviewing their Ninth Harmonic Chart?? Hugs- GemStar
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Post by samina on Aug 9, 2006 21:26:55 GMT
Yes, my thoughts exactly!
Time for me to get to some work, now... Mars in Virgo is so busy energizing my chart -- I don't want to dissipate its benefits! Which I surely have, but am trying to mitigate the damage. LOL
samina
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Post by Juliet on Aug 9, 2006 23:15:33 GMT
Hoi Gem, I don't get that 9th harmonic MC so close to the AC... I checked the father of my kids'es, and he has his AC and MC both in Virgo!
I'd like the AC so close together in natal and 9th harmonic. What would bring you peace is obviously already there... available in your toolkit.
By the way, your natal AC-DC axis is 40 minutes conjunct my MC-IC axis. You can handle a few squares with these stellia conjunct the DC's. I'm surrounded by people (my 16 year old daughter the champion (her chart is one huge t-square) with tons of squares and they are actually forced to be creative, to find solutions for internal stress at an early age. Whereas I could put off a lot of work till rather late in life, with my Grand Trine POF/Sun/Moon. Always cozy/comfy. Duh.
Prima, could it be that your NNO so close to the AP would cause this position in your harmonic charts?? I'm really bad in astrological arithmetics, so I don't understand how they work- yet. My last ex has his natal SN on my 9th h NN, and lots of other stuff. His Moon and Sun are conjunct the apex of my 9th h grand trine Moon, Chiron, MC/Juno, Mercury.
Love, Juliet
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Post by gemstar on Aug 9, 2006 23:41:06 GMT
Hey Juliet....I am with you on the not completely understanding the AC and MC being less than 90 degrees or so...much less in the same sign!!!! Hmm.....I will have to do a little digging. One article discussed the calculations and it was too confusing to store in my brain. Like you, the natal Grand trine is easy....yet sometimes I could use a better push with things. As far as the grand square in this 9th harmonic....well, maybe it explains more difficulties than are found in the natal chart? I don't know. My stresses are usually handled fairly well.....and the more which is piled on me, the stronger I stand. (Courtesy of Scorpio ASC-natally and 9th harmonic!). Perhaps some more digging with Google will give us additional leads. As far as deciding where the JOY is......how did you determine that it would involve the ASC? I do not feel all my tools are in the same box.....they seem to be scattered all over the house!!! Hugs- GemStar
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Post by blueorchids on Aug 10, 2006 0:12:42 GMT
I am also having problems reading it my 9th Harmonic! So I went to the addiitonal charts and it says CANCER is on the cusp at 29 degrees for my 6th house but then it has CANCER at the cusp of the 11th house at 2 degrees. I looked back at the chart and that makes no sense whatsoever. There is a formula but I don't get it. I always assumed AScendant meant house 1 and MC meant House 10?
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Post by gemstar on Aug 10, 2006 1:00:04 GMT
The object I think of reading the Ninth Harmonic charts is to look at the ASPECTS....and do not count the houses.....so focus on your aspects and compare any conjunctions to that of your natal chart or that of your love's etc.....family members....etc..... Hey Blue....were you able to pull up your Ninth Harmonic? I didn't pull up the additional chart as everything I needed was right there. So....take a look at the aspects and tell us what you see??!! We have not figured out the significance of the ASC or MC placement other than aspects it makes to planets within the 9th Harmonic chart. Hopefully we will find further information!! For now-Focus on the aspects and comparisons. Hugs- GemStar
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Post by primamateria on Aug 10, 2006 1:38:19 GMT
Hi everyone! this thread rocks Juliet - I wondered about that AP thing too... I have a few ideas about this but they aren't fully formed enough to put down in writing yet... yes, my understanding is that one looks at the overall pattern of the harmonic charts - connecting with themes and not looking to houses or even so much signs...its aspects and elements that we need to focus on.. so if I look at mine I can see a grand square and a kite... having contemplated this I do recognise that joy does indeed come from finding my center, creativity and calm within situations which involve tensions or slight stress... in other words I thrive under conditions where I am required to use management skills and in positions of responsibility - where I am visibly active (i.e not so much behind the scenes) and where I can best harmonise my mind/intuition... can see this reflected in that grand square between Cap-Aries-Cancer-Libra. when 'times are good' I create mischief for my self - take on extra responsibility... in the past I have manifested dramas to complicate my own life - because this my comfort zone or 'habitus'. Saturn-Venus opposite each other in the ninth harmonic chart is very interesting, especially as I'm now in a relationship with a man who's natal Saturn is exactly conjunct my natal Venus (and his ninth harmonic Venus is conjunct my ninth harmonic Saturn)... I'm watching this dynamic now, observing how these energies work between us. I can feel something happening to me that's for sure... a sense of permanence that I'm not familiar with... activating what I think is a previously unacknowledged Saturnine stability in me... I have an 11th house Saturn which I have tended towards manifesting as loneliness rather than 'a place in the community'... boundaries that have kept me out, rather than in. more later, pm
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Post by jamma on Aug 10, 2006 3:37:16 GMT
Wow, in the time it took me to figure out how to run the 9th Harmonic (first time I forgot to change the house system to Equal), everybody has been posting like crazy ... I don't understand the Asc & MC relationship, either ... but in the "additional tables," at least the Dsc appears to be 180 degrees away the Asc, where it belongs ... Posting it here just to see what connections there are to others on the forum ... jam ...
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Post by gemstar on Aug 10, 2006 5:15:08 GMT
Prima.....thanks for highlighting your thoughts with your Grand Square in the 9th Harmonic. Because I do not have any T-squares or Grand-crosses in my natal, I am not entirely how I should read this one. Your thoughts were helpful!
Jamma....what are your thoughts on 9th Harmonic Venus conjuncting your SNode? How does this chart compare with your natal chart? Did you find any similar patterns? Conjunctions?
Yes...this is a fun subject and another exciting place to look for more astro-clues into the greatness and JOY which is a part of each person!!
Hugs- GemStar
PS- Geez....wish I could fall asleep tonight....it is getting late!!!
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Post by samina on Aug 10, 2006 13:41:45 GMT
Hey guys,
I think the only correct house cusps listed in the 9H tables are for the AC & MC -- the rest are mathematical glitches because the system is reading them off of the natural chart cusps that display on the chart as shown.
I'm not too sure about why we should be discounting the houses & axes... seems to me they should be just as valuable here as elsewhere, especially in synastry. Any thoughts on that?
For example, Jamma, your 9H Anti-Vertex is conjunct your 9H ASC in the 1st. Am curious what part of your natal chart that would bring forward (similar to reading return charts, y'know?).
Say Prima, is your Saturn man significantly older than you, or does he feel that way or assume that role? Curious, because I imagine that his Saturn on your Venus would be a very noticeable influence.
sami
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