BACCHUS 2063

[svenskasfinx]

Hello Kim and others!

I was wondering if you could give me and other's the "run down" on Bacchus 2063-- its been a topic a while back on one of the various threads, but one spacific question:

What is the main difference which seperates Bacchus from Pan?

My intuition tells me that Pan is just natural at what he does, and Bacchus is divinely insane..

Adding to this I noticed a while back in my massive amount of 5th house asteroids an interesting group around my South Node, a conjunction of Bacchus, Terpsichore, and Sappho (with Erato in the 11th degree in Libra in some small influence to the South Node at 14 degrees Libra)

In the chart of one of my musical mentor's Pete Shelley one can find Bacchus and Sappho in close conjunction in his 5th house in Aquarius.. but what does that mean about creativity?

Just wondering about that; I have been very inspired by some of the questions involving the muses, Pan, and Chiron, but sadly the spacifics do not exactly apply, but its nice to read.

Take care all,

Svenskasfinx

[Kim Falconer]

The Romans loved Bacchus! He was considered an ultimate deity, the recipient of highest reverence. The Bacchanalia, his festive celebration, consisted of decadent eating, drinking, sex and total abandon. He knew how to cut loose. After all, he was the son of Zeus and raised by the Nysaean nymphs.

Bacchus, although the Roman name for the Greek Dionysus, is somewhat less “spiritual” in nature than his predecessor. Dionysus was like a dark Christ figure, driven mad by Hera and offering redemption through ecstasy. Bacchus is not dismembered and resurrected as Dionysus, though he is mad as well. Bacchus is more about pleasure through excess than redemption through excess…if that makes sense.

Dionysus showed mortals how to express their passions through mania (passionate outpouring as opposed to clinical madness).

Bacchus showed mortals how to cultivate fruit trees and grapes and turn them into wine. He is a god of vegetation, the vineyard and the wine itself.

How is he different from Pan?

Pan, for one, is much older. He is the great ALL. He is wild in nature and does not cultivate anything save perhaps an extremely healthy libido.

He shows mortals the realm of the senses, taste, touch, smell, sound by exploration in the body—with the body. He is extremely physical.

Bacchus (and Dionysus) are more about escape from the body and the logic of routine into the realm of ecstasy, passion though vision and distortion (drugs and alcohol). I wonder where Timothy Leary’s Bacchus & Dionysus was…<br>
What about creativity? My friend Zane Stein says this:

“There is another side to Bacchus, though. I have also found it prominent in the charts of a number of truly artistic individuals who get totally immersed in their work. These people seem to become one with the creative process, losing themselves and the world while they are painting, composing or whatever.”<br>
www.geocities.com/SoHo/7969/bacchus.htm
Does this make sense?

Kim

[svenskasfinx]

Hej Kim!

that difference actually explains a lot. Being a person with a retrograde Neptune.. according to most astrological documents, and some of the people I have most encountered in art school ect.. they found my more than consious ways some what an enigma...

Being as I am not a person who drinks (I can count on one hand how many times I have been under the influence of alchohol) and I have never taken drugs.. but so many people joked around with me and asked me constantly "What kind of drugs do you take to get inspiration like this...?"

Its also a problem for me because people do assume I'm a "space cadet" too often, but that must be something else.

I get the idea that Pan is an accute awareness to things around, a sensitivity to the environment around one's self, which could be the reason I have such sympathy for animals. (notice my husband has Pan strongly too and our comp has Pan in the first house.)

But that Bacchus thing, interesting and inspired but mostly seen as avoiding the real for the imagined, which is not bad (12 house also seems to be that area) but it can lead to not being aware of the body, and taking the body for granted, (like with those of us who don't eat while inspired or totally deny yourself in a truely work-aholic fashion those things your body cries for.)

Pan is definately a friend.. not that Bacchus isn't, its just not easily expressed, for me.

Thanks for your response.

svenskasfinx

[Kim Falconer]

I think that is a good point, about Pan’s awareness of the environment. He not only senses everything around him, he participates! It is like the meeting of two animals in the woods. All their senses tell them of the other…and then they fight, or play or mate or hunt…they participate, they connect. I think Pan is something like this. He also taught…mostly sexual arts but also music and divination!

Bacchus and Dionysus may get so caught up in the creation, or the redemption or the spiritual participation that they neglect the body…though the senses are still very much involved. The ecstasy they offer is through the physical experience of pleasure and indulgence so that the body may be transcended, though it starts there.

Thanks for your comments.

Kim

[svenskasfinx]

Hej everyone!

I just noticed yesterday a transit to my 7th house cusp of asteroid (2063) Bacchus.

How is this acting in relation to my physical nature, and my long term relationships? Well I've been feeling an urge to seek enjoyment in alcohol!!! I have never really been so interested in drinking anything until now..but it was after I had Pernod, I finally discovered a drink I actually liked!

Not that I sought out to get drunk or anything, I was just amazed at the "euphoria" I felt for a short while, and it does tend, just like Neptune, to "desolve" barriers and boarders between people. (needless to say I've still not tried Absinthe yet but I'm trying to locate a good one that is under 60% (thus being legal in this country because anything over that is illegal, but the absinthe itself is totally legal here)

I also get the feeling my nerves are more "tuned toward pleasure" as well.

Just an observation, nothing to be alarmed about, but it is very much a good surprise!

Anyone else notice things happening with a Bacchus transit to a major point in their chart? Just curious.. here

take care,

svenskasfinx

[Kim Falconer]

Svenskasfinx,

This is fascinating feedback on Bacchus.

For those wanting to check their charts, Bacchus is Retrograde right now at 27 Sagittarius. He spends an unusually long time in the sign of the Archer this year, and then spins around and shoots forward!

I’ll comment in the “Eros Guide” when he catchers up there!
Kim
From Swiss Ephemeris
Positions of Bacchus
Date Long
----------------------------------------
15 Mar 2005 --27 sa 41 Rx
25 Mar 2005 --24 sa 58 Rx
04 Apr 2005 --20 sa 47 Rx
14 Apr 2005 --14 sa 28 Rx
24 Apr 2005 -- 5 sa 59 Rx
04 May 2005 --26 sc 27 Rx
14 May 2005 --17 sc 43 Rx
24 May 2005 --11 sc 15 Rx
03 Jun 2005 -- 7 sc 21 Rx
13 Jun 2005 -- 5 sc 43 Rx
23 Jun 2005 -- 5 sc 49
03 Jul 2005 -- 7 sc 12
13 Jul 2005 -- 9 sc 33
23 Jul 2005 --12 sc 38
02 Aug 2005 --16 sc 16
12 Aug 2005 --20 sc 23
22 Aug 2005 --24 sc 51
01 Sep 2005 --29 sc 40
11 Sep 2005 -- 4 sa 47
21 Sep 2005 --10 sa 10
01 Oct 2005 --15 sa 50
11 Oct 2005 --21 sa 46
21 Oct 2005 --27 sa 59
31 Oct 2005 -- 4 cp 29
10 Nov 2005 --11 cp 18
20 Nov 2005 --18 cp 27
30 Nov 2005 --25 cp 59
10 Dec 2005 -- 3 aq 55
20 Dec 2005 --12 aq 17
30 Dec 2005 --21 aq 9
09 Jan 2006 -- 0 pi 32

[marie]

Hi Kim and All,

My natal Bacchus is 6 degrees Scorpio, so it looks like Eros is currently conjuncting it. I did spend the weekend with friends out on the town, and there was a good bit of Bacchus juice induldged in by all! The energy was very electric and I felt so alive and especially good.

I am experiencing a lot of energy in that area of my chart right now; as I mentioned in another post, this is the placement of my midheaven.

He is transiting my twefth house now, and squaring my Moon. I'm not sure what the effect is - something to think about.

Bye for now,

Bridget Marie

[shizane85]

I have a question. If my dionysus is in aries and my bacchus is in scorpio, what does it mean? I drink, but not a lot. I've experimented with drugs, but Im clean now. Thanks.

[ana]

I am so happy to check in here and find the Bacchus stuff as I only just realised it was conj my Psyche2/[Bac8]Mars8/Sappho8/Phaethon9 and got a bit freaked until I realised I was not really in danger of turning into a wild boozer etc etc if it had not appeared yet
Phaethon explains why I have a licence but refuse to drive after noticing how absent minded I was at it when younger
I do not drink or drug at all and never have apart from late teenage at weekends for 2 years But I AM an artist and I am unhappy if I do not get to dance a lot And I had more energy than I knew what to do with until I had children which tended to use it up okay...... I do various bodywork therapies and am very into the bodymind connection
So I reckon strong Bacchus can be positive and am relieved Thanks folks

[ama]

I should add that those planets are in first house

[jamma]

What sign is Bacchus in?

[shizane85]

Hello,
Could someone inform the difference between Bacchus in scorpio and Bacchus in sagittatius? Is one more prone to drugs and/or alcohol than the other? Thanks.

[ana]

jamma- My Bacchus etc is in Gem I guess the sign is important....... but the aspects probably more so? My 2nd son has Bacchus con Pluto in Libra in 2 well aspected and has made a lot of his money in good restaurants while studying
My 1st son has Bacchus in end of 8th house 9degrees from his 9th house Sun in Aquarius He certainly has huge capacity to have too much of anything that alters states but he/his chart is complex Charts always seem to have the same story told in different ways all over them like good lecturers making sure they get the point over

[shizane85]

Speaking of creativity- My bacchus is in Scorpio in the 5th house. It is and it's sextile jupiter and conjunct my saturn. Maybe that also explains some of the musician in me?

[q]

My Bacchus is in Cappy in the 1st house, conjunct Neptune. It leads me to believe, based on my life, that I like to make my work fun or I just can't do it. And also I just plain like fun and debauchery with the whole first house thing. The Neptune conjunction is loose, but could add to escapism needs...oh yes. Even if it's just through meditation