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Post by lunariviera on Feb 11, 2006 9:22:55 GMT
Hello, I've been a longtime lurker of this branch of the forum and have learned quite a bit from reading other people's posts and interpretations...I've never studied a lick of Horary astrology, nor really ever knew what it was until now...I figured I must be missing out on some something special, so just this evening I ran my first horary chart and of course it involes love (how original?!)...I was hoping some kind soul would help me to break down some of the components so that I may get a feel for the potential behind my question...here goes: I asked: "Will I find a partner and be in a romantic relationship soon?" (I agonized about the "soon" part because that is rather ambiguous...but I leaped before I looked in this instance)...now, I don't know if gender or sexual orienation plays a role(?)...so if it does, I figure I should state up front that I'm a gay male so the pronoun would be "he" in both cases!(hopefully that doesn't present a problem for anyone?) The chart  Here's what I've been able to deduct just from the limited knowledge I have... Mars, the classic ruler of Scorpio, represents me...my co-ruler is the Moon in Leo... This "partner" that I speak of must then be assigned the role of Venus, since it rules the sign on the desc. (Taurus)...? From what I can tell, Mars does not make any further aspects and I presume it could be considered void of course?! (stop me if I'm wrong!)... Before reaching Saturn's doorstep, the Moon trines the North Node and opposes Chiron...I presume the Moon-Saturn conjunction about to take place doesn't bode too well for my question?!...at least initially...following that it makes all kinds of aspects while continuing it's journey through the sign of Leo...off the bat, I notice that it will square the ASC, oppose Neptune, cross the MC, and oppose the Sun (a full Moon), etc... "His" ruler (Venus) is approaching a sextile to Jupiter and eventually a trine to my ruler (Mars)...my question is, do I apply the same aspect principle to any of the other planets at play here or is that solely the domain of the Moon?! This is the inevitable point where I get stuck... What does it mean that my ruler is in the house of partnerships (my 7th, "his" 1st)?...in another thread, someone commented on this exact case and said that either the person is already there or I would be going to them, etc...am I mistaken? The classic ruler of my 5th House is Jupiter and it's in the 1st house...is that significant?! Does the Moon-Saturn conjunction indicate the the answer to my question is "no"? Any help or advice would be much appreciated!!!..Thank you so much for your time and consideration...I'm definitely looking forward to any and all input that you might have to better illuminate this area of astrology for me (and get to the bottom of my question)! -Michael (lunariviera)  |
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Post by Kim Falconer on Feb 11, 2006 21:10:06 GMT
Hi Lunariviera, You are right about your ruler Mars, going 'over' to him...your energy moves out towards him and it is possible that you have already met or you know him. Could that be? Sometimes we 'pass over' potential partners because they are familiar or we see them in a certain way that is of another context. Think about who you know or just be aware of who you meet in the next 'soon bit of time'...(subtly) because I do get the feeling that you are 'around him'. The 'soon' is a little tricky because it's a little ambiguous. Still, the chart is readable and worth exploring! The moon, (surprise surprise) was last over Mars. This is so common for our forum...it means that there is a feeling of energy, enthusiasm, urgency and desire associated with the question. That seems to fit! Jupiter in the first house is a boost and a blessing! It brings optimism and 'lucky breaks' (being in the right place at the right time), expands the possibilities and protects the querent! Being ruler of the romantic 5th also suggests that there might be someone attracted to you that you don't realize yet! I do get the feeling that you guys know each other, or that when you meet, it'll be like 'old friends'! This is a very nurturing feeling. Mars is not really considered VOC as far as I know, being that faster moving planets will aspect him. The Moon gets that tag because nothing (no planetary body) moves faster than she does, so when she's VOC, that's it for contacts. I do not see the conjunction to Saturn as a NO. (Is this in any of the text books?) It simply describes an event related to the question. There could be a commitment in short order, or perhaps you work together, or it could indicate some difficulties that need to be worked through...but not 'NO'. It would be nice if Venus could complete her aspect to Mars before Mars slips into Gemini, but she doesn’t. Still, she is in wide orb of a trine. I get the feeling that the next relationship could involve some ‘distance’ issues – a situation where there is a strong connection, love, romance and at the same time challenges about proximity, or availability…that sort of thing. This is just one possibility!!! Please do not be limited by anything I say! We just see that trine that can’t complete itself before Mars moves on, and the final aspect is the Moon square to Mars…(when the Moon’s final aspect is a square there can be a feeling that you abandon the ‘project’ or decide that it isn’t right for you after all). It could be that ‘soon’ you will have a romance (yeah!) though it may not turn out to be an ongoing partner…or the partner that you will meet later. I do like that Jupiter rising through, and the Vertex on the AP, so I feel that this next romance will be pivotal and good for you. Just take it step by step and don’t feel pressured into a major commitment too soon. (and it’s early and I haven’t had any coffee all week so PLEASE let’s hear what others see in this chart. I’ll come back to it soon!)  Kim |
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Post by lunariviera on Feb 12, 2006 7:41:39 GMT
Hi Lunariviera, You are right about your ruler Mars, going 'over' to him...your energy moves out towards him and it is possible that you have already met or you know him. Could that be? Sometimes we 'pass over' potential partners because they are familiar or we see them in a certain way that is of another context. Could be?!...although I lead a rather minimalistic life at the moment...I basically go to work and come home...I see friends fairly regularly (and I consider my co-workers friends), but they're rather cerebral affairs (long discussions over tea or over the telephone, etc.)....I work as a receptionist at a day spa in an upscale health club...so I do come in contact with a variety of people, but none that I would necessarily consider potential partners (this gym seems to cater to a mostly older, weatlhy, and to be quite blunt...straight clientele...so the potential dating pool is more like a puddle)... Couldn't be more true!...I asked the question in a particularly desperate moment as I'm sure other single people can attest to with Valentine's Day fast approaching!!! I suppose there are people attracted to us all the time who we are completely oblivious to (in respect to their romantic interest)...again, my life has been on auto-pilot, so I haven't really been tuned into the hidden motivations of others...I'm sort of blissfully unaware most days...but it's kind of nice to know that we are being "seen", even when we are not expecting it!!!...Jupiter in the 1st does seem like it would add a bit of divine intervention or act as a cosmic sheild ensuring that events unfold in a fateful manner...I never considered the fact that the Vertex was on the Aries Point...thank you so much for mentioning that!!! Wow...thank you for adding a positive spin to the Moon-Saturn conjunction...I guess I get hung up on the more dour interpretations of Saturn contacts...but I also suspect that it might mean that emotional exchanges or pleasantries are withheld or more "sober" in nature...perhaps it is someone in my vortex who fancies me, but for some reason, there's limitations to the expression of the interest?!...could it also indicate that the person may be "older" or at least perceived as such?! I'm saddened that the Venus-Mars trine is never fully completed, thus it may be over before it begins (or never really materializes)?!...I don't want to get too hung up on outcomes or attachments to an ideal (with a natal 12th house Venus and a Mars-Neptune opposition in the 5th-11th axis, it's a very real danger for me)...I'm easily prone to heartbreak and disappointments (who isn't?!) and I don't know if I could handle another "close, but no cigar" type situation... At any rate, thank you so much for being so very supportive and forthcoming with advice and encouragement...I would hug you if you could Kim because the fluid and elegant style with with which you dispense astrological wisdom is beyond measure!!! I feel bad that every thread I create basically morphs into a conversation between just you and I... I definitely don't want to usurp your time and attention...please, please know I that absolutely respect and appreciate your input and consider it to be invaluable...so if you see anything else in this chart that we might have missed, please don't hesitate to share!!! The same goes for anyone else who has a firmer grasp on horary, unlike myself!!! Thank you so much...again and again! -Michael |
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Post by Kim Falconer on Feb 12, 2006 21:29:29 GMT
You're very welcome, Michael!
I do hope others will comment soon--there are some very intuitive and insightful Horary students on this forum!!! I definitely want to hear from them.
Oh, I so know what you mean about 'Valentine's Day looming..." Ugh. Who invents these 'days'?
I suspect the most important energy to evoke at this time (which probably goes for all of us) is to let go of ALL expectations and assumptions when it come to relationship!
Really! All of them!
Blessings,
Kim
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Post by lunariviera on Apr 24, 2006 7:21:24 GMT
I suppose this post should be titled, "My second attempt at Horary..." This evening, I was overcome with the urgent need to run another horary chart related to love....this time I decided to be a bit more specific when I posed my question...the question being: "Will I find a boyfriend within the next 6 months?"Very similar to my first inquiry, but with the addition of a time frame, so I figured it wasn't exactly a retread(?)... At any rate, this is the chart my question generated:  I'm so green when it comes to interpretation, but I'll give it a shot: The first thing I looked to see was if the chart itself was radical...thankfully, it appears to be! (correct me if I'm wrong?...the ASC is a late degree Sag, but not late enough for the question to be outdated or "too soon to tell"?) The chart ruler is Jupiter Rx and it's ensconced in the 11th house...obviously I'm dealing with a question that inspires a great deal of hope in regards to the actualization of a wish(?)... There appears to be a lot of nice trines to Jupiter in this chart, including a grand trine with Uranus, the Moon, Venus, and Mars (albeit a very wide orb)...the trines are related to the air houses in water signs, therefore I presume this relates to the fact that I've assigned this matter a great deal of emotional thought...I'm venturing to guess that there is an element of fantasy and escapism involved with the Jupiter-Neptune square?! The last aspect the Moon (the co-ruler) made was an exact trine to the chart ruler and before that, a conjunction with Uranus (the urgency of the question?)...the next aspects that follow are a trine to Vesta and a conjunction with Venus (a good thing, right?!)...I'm a little bit confused and worried about the final aspect the Moon will make during its stay in the sign of Pisces, namely the square to Pluto...although I'm wondering if I should count the 29th degree of Pisces as being in conjunction with the North Node?! With Pluto Rx rising, I will go out on a limb and say that the question holds tremendous psychological weight?! I wasn't sure what to look at in terms of house cusps that relate to the question...I would guess the 5th and 7th house cusps would be appropriate...the cusp of the 5th being 7 Taurus (Venus ruled) and the 7th is obviously 22 Gemini (Mercury ruled)...from there, I'm stumped! I have no idea as to how to determine timing, much less the answer to my question (as well as the more subtle dimensions involved in determining potential upcoming events)... I would very much appreciate any and all input, advice, wisdom, guidance, clarity, etc.! Thank you so much! |
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Post by Juliet on Apr 24, 2006 10:19:52 GMT
Hi Lunar!
I'll have a shot at it. Next time please leave out all asteroids, just POF and vertex will do. I redid the chart in Regiomontanus, which I prefer.
Only applying aspects count in determining what will happen, although the separating ones can be quite informative.
As you saw, you're Jupiter in 11, the house of friendship, but also of hope and trust. Your mind obviously is on love, you're in Venuses term. You're not in the best condition= retrograde. But that will change. Jupiter is in applying trine with Mars yes! Mars rules 11 and 4. Mars was in 7 the last time too. Do not ask the same question too often! Actually you cannot ask the same question when there has been no drastic change of circumstances.
Mercury is ruler of 7, represents your (serious) bf to be, and is in 4. Still a 'hidden' treasure.There is no applying Ptolemeic aspect between your rulers.
Your co-ruler Moon is in 3, in it's joy and about to conjunct Venus. You will be restless and get around a lot the coming time!
Venus is ruler of 5 of affairs, so I think there will be something more along that line within the timeframe you're asking about. 4 weeks, 4 months? There are rules about this timing, but for me it always works best to see what happened in the past. Say if you were seeing someone three months ago and there is a separating aspect of 6 degrees, you can deduct that each degree covers 2 weeks.
Moon is in Mercury's term, so the 'real' one is close somehow. Moon's last aspect will be a square to Pluto in 1, so I believe there will be some more emotional transformation/crisis for you before the bf. Don't worry about it too much. I cannot count all the instances where people met their destiny only after a crisis! Makes sense, doesn't it?
I wish you a lot of fun!!!
Juliet
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Post by lunariviera on Apr 25, 2006 1:54:19 GMT
Hi Lunar! I'll have a shot at it. Next time please leave out all asteroids, just POF and vertex will do. I redid the chart in Regiomontanus, which I prefer. Only applying aspects count in determining what will happen, although the separating ones can be quite informative. As you saw, you're Jupiter in 11, the house of friendship, but also of hope and trust. Your mind obviously is on love, you're in Venuses term. You're not in the best condition= retrograde. But that will change. Jupiter is in applying trine with Mars yes! Mars rules 11 and 4. Mars was in 7 the last time too. Do not ask the same question too often! Actually you cannot ask the same question when there has been no drastic change of circumstances. Mercury is ruler of 7, represents your (serious) bf to be, and is in 4. Still a 'hidden' treasure.There is no applying Ptolemeic aspect between your rulers. Your co-ruler Moon is in 3, in it's joy and about to conjunct Venus. You will be restless and get around a lot the coming time! Venus is ruler of 5 of affairs, so I think there will be something more along that line within the timeframe you're asking about. 4 weeks, 4 months? There are rules about this timing, but for me it always works best to see what happened in the past. Say if you were seeing someone three months ago and there is a separating aspect of 6 degrees, you can deduct that each degree covers 2 weeks. Moon is in Mercury's term, so the 'real' one is close somehow. Moon's last aspect will be a square to Pluto in 1, so I believe there will be some more emotional transformation/crisis for you before the bf. Don't worry about it too much. I cannot count all the instances where people met their destiny only after a crisis! Makes sense, doesn't it? I wish you a lot of fun!!! Juliet Thank you so much Juliet for responding and helping me to dissect this chart even further...the issue is definitely coming into clearer focus now that I'm armed with some of your insights! If you don't mind me asking what I presume is a silly question...what does it mean when you speak of a planet being in "term?" When you mentioned either 4 weeks or 4 months, how did you arrive that?! (curiosity strikes deep)...is the timing derived from progressing the chart?!...I assume that something related to the question will occur when the Moon conjuncts and passes over Venus(?)...likewise, when the Moon exactly squares Pluto?! (although, this will occur after the 6th month timeframe I've set)... As you said, I figured that since the Moon's last exact aspect will be with Pluto, something profound might have to happen first before it manifests(?)...I'm hoping the crisis is more psychological than actual because I've got enough on my plate as it is... The potential affairs as related to the Venus ruled 5th sounds fun and intriguing, but this time I think I'm holding out for something more, so perhaps it will relate more to enjoyable pursuits that will feed and sustain me creatively?! I liked what you said about the "b.f." (Mercury) being hidden as it exists in close conjunction to the nadir...wonder where he's hiding?! (hehe)... As with the other chart I ran back in February, you mentioned that this person is potentially close because the Moon is in "Mercury's term." Does this relate to the fact that the Moon is in the 3rd house (the classic domain of Mercury) and Mercury is in the 4th (the Moon's natural home)?! I guess I'm getting tripped up on the word "close" as it pertains to proximity. He could very well be psychically "close." Is there any clue as to how I might meet this person and in what capacity?! Forgive me for all the questions, it's just that as I get deeper into the subject, I find that there are sometimes more questions than answers...although, that's the best way to learn and your help (along with anyone else who wishes to contribute) is very much appreciated!!!...I'm really looking forward to how this all might unfold!!! |
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Post by lunariviera on May 3, 2006 21:46:23 GMT
I'm sorry for seeming redundant...but I still have a question about the use of timing in horary...is it possible to progress the chart so that the Moon's aspects are in motion, rather than stagnant (i.e. are events linked to the Moon's applying aspects and is the chart itself always active like any progressed chart?!)?! Thanks! |
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Post by Juliet on May 4, 2006 21:57:31 GMT
Hi LunaR,
Sorry I did not get back earlier, very busy now..
As soon as have more time, I'll try to answer you...
My best, Juliet
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Post by Kim Falconer on May 4, 2006 22:14:26 GMT
Hello Lunariviera,
I agree with everything Juliet noted---she gave a very concise and informative interpretation. I would only add a question, 'Where is the Arabic Part of Fortune"?
Okay, I just worked it out at 10 Aquarius. ...and the declinations….hmmmm
Mercury, in that 4th house...and parallel the North Node makes me think "he is right under your nose". Didn't I say something like this before???
I go with the number '4', as Juliet did. You have 4 degrees until Moon conjuncts Venus and 4 degrees until the two rulers (Jupiter and mercury) are inconjunct. This aspect is minor but can indicate 'a third party' or the need for you to 'support the partner in some way'. Maybe they are the one's having an emotional crisis and it will fall on you to be there for them....anything's possible.
So, we don't progress the chart in the way we do secondary progressions (that I know of) but we do allow the chart to 'play out' by transit until the moon changes signs. That means that we count all the approaching aspects the moon makes, and the approaching quincunx between rulers, etc and use these aspects as 'timers'.
Does that make sense?
Hope that helps.
Warmly,
Kim
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Post by Kim Falconer on May 4, 2006 22:17:39 GMT
Oh, the other thing, because of the mutual reception between your ruler and Pluto, we can let them change places, keeping their degrees. That puts Pluto at 26 Scorpio, making the last aspect Moon trine Pluto. Does that make sense? Kim |
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Post by lunariviera on May 5, 2006 6:30:56 GMT
For starters, let me apologize for not including the Part of Fortune...I don't know how or why I would forget to include it?!... Hi LunaR, Sorry I did not get back earlier, very busy now.. As soon as have more time, I'll try to answer you... My best, Juliet No worries Juliet...you've already been an immense help and I can't thank you enough and any further insights you might have are wholeheartedly welcomed! Hello Lunariviera, I agree with everything Juliet noted---she gave a very concise and informative interpretation. I would only add a question, 'Where is the Arabic Part of Fortune"? Okay, I just worked it out at 10 Aquarius. ...and the declinations….hmmmm Mercury, in that 4th house...and parallel the North Node makes me think "he is right under your nose". Didn't I say something like this before??? I go with the number '4', as Juliet did. You have 4 degrees until Moon conjuncts Venus and 4 degrees until the two rulers (Jupiter and mercury) are inconjunct. This aspect is minor but can indicate 'a third party' or the need for you to 'support the partner in some way'. Maybe they are the one's having an emotional crisis and it will fall on you to be there for them....anything's possible. So, we don't progress the chart in the way we do secondary progressions (that I know of) but we do allow the chart to 'play out' by transit until the moon changes signs. That means that we count all the approaching aspects the moon makes, and the approaching quincunx between rulers, etc and use these aspects as 'timers'. Does that make sense? Hope that helps. Warmly, Kim Kim, thank you so much for replying and having a go at this chart for me!!! ... I'm so pleased that this chart contains many aspects that reinforce one another, which lets me know that there's some weight to the question... Thanks for clearing up my confusion surrounding the issue of whether or not I should progress the chart...I thought that events related to the progressions of the Moon, as in, when the SP Moon conjuncts the Horary Venus something related to the question will manifest...this shows what a novice I am!... It's nice to know that you and Juliet concur that '4' weeks or months (?!) is a definite possibility or timetable for the question... You have indeed mentioned that this person is somehow and in someway in my vortex (right under my nose)...that's both comforting and frustrating...but all things are revealed in time! Thank you as well for pointing out the quincunx and inconjunct aspects and for elaborating on the nature of them (I was formerly clueless)...and thanks for pointing out the parallel between the NN and Mercury...I tend to miss these sorts of important details, but it makes a world of sense! Oh, the other thing, because of the mutual reception between your ruler and Pluto, we can let them change places, keeping their degrees. That puts Pluto at 26 Scorpio, making the last aspect Moon trine Pluto. Does that make sense? Kim It's comforting to know that I can transpose the signs that Jupiter and Pluto are in (thanks to a mutual reception) to subsequently create a more harmonious and soft final aspect... Thank you both so much for taking the time to consider my question and evaluate my chart(s)!!! I'm trying to remain detached and allow events to unfold as they will without getting fixated on any particular outcome...but I would very much like to meet someone new and I'm just grateful that this chart quite possibly supports such a possibility!!! As always, any other insights would be met with much appreciation!!! With sincere gratitude, lunariviera |
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