meaning of asteroid echo (60)

[erosinvirgo]

Does someone here have some insight or experience with echo (60) ?
Could it mean unrequited love in regard of the mythology ? What asteroid could have something to do with unrequited love ? Sometimes anteros not well aspected with eros could mean such things but do someone here know about other things perhaps ?

Thanks

[Neon Artemis]

Yikes, I have it within 3 degrees of my north node in Libra! I think instead of just looking at it like "unrequited love", perhaps it needs to be broken down a bit as to WHY we get into situations like that to understand it more thoroughly.

I'd say it's about learning not to project yourself onto people, relationships or trying to fill a void with someone else externally, and maybe it's where you have tendancies to deny your own power/give it away in relationship or in regards to the "other". Perhaps it is a type of obsession/love that is sacrifical because you don't love yourself. If you follow down this path, you become an "echo" of yourself because you're not giving yourself any energy and love, (self-love is the core and anchor of our beings) and you're expending it all on a thankless person which makes you waste away in essence because you're not being nourished. Giving away of self-essence. You may have a tendancy to not develop yourself and orbit around someone else where echo is. Perhaps echo is also where we feel some kind of void that we think we must fill with someone else? Where we deny our own power or worth and give it all to someone external and perhaps are likely to repeat it until we learn.

If Echo loved and honored herself a little more, she would have been a real person and not an echo who could only repeat things back - maybe it's where we are extremely insecure and afraid or lack the ability to express ourselves.

Echo and Narcissus - They were both definately half-shells of people because they had a lack of true self-love, (vanity is not true self-love, it's lack of true connection to authentic self so one fixates on image/idea of what they are like a drug addict - it's never enough) so of course there is going to be a tragic ending. I think of Narcissus (and narcissism) as a hungry black hole gorging on itself because of lack of self love or self- connection, and Echo willingly losing energy into the black hole and letting it devour her because of lack of self love or connection.

I think they were both two sides of the same coin, just a different polarized expression of the same energy. Victims of their own illusions and "idealization" (idea) of someone. (Narcissus of himself, Echo of Narcissus.) Perhaps it's the quest to get in touch with your own true individuality inwardly instead of externally.

[AquarianEssence]

Hi all. It may be beneficial to research the various versions of the myth. So many myths are changed to fit the agenda of the times. From what I read in several places, the young beautiful boy Narcissus, was punished because he refused the affections of other boys. Soul and spirit, his echo, perhaps, is the sacred feminine. One story says that he had a twin sister, a twin soul or soul mate perhaps, and it was she he longed for. It is very possible the pondering of his own reflection was an attempt to learn who spirit, his soul mate. Apparently Echo may very well have been the word from which all creation originated so then would be the creator goddess. There is no genology listed for her, but there wouldn't be if she were the word of creation, she would be the source.

I knew there had to be more to this story. I have experienced Narcissus, both in my garden and with my essential oil work. When I inhale the fragrance, I am carried away to a more spiritual plane. It is more noticable with the essential oil because it is more concentrated. There is a narcotic that can be obtained from the plant. In fact the word narcotic may share the same etomology with narcissus. Tuberose has the same effect, its like a mirror in which we ca touch the heavens and our divine origin. If one catches a glimpse of this perfect mate, he may withhold from anything less. It was a male suitor who eventually led to his death. Here's a page that was quite interesting:
www.paghat.com/narcissusmyth1.html

"From the lingering bits of a largely forgotten mythology, it seems probable that Echo worship regarded Her as the "spark" that dwells within each of us, that which Narcissus mistook for his twin sister, a beautiful maiden, or his soul. All the Greek words for Spirit or Soul are feminine words, & so in Greek myth the soul is often personified as a nymph or goddess, Psyche as lover of Eros being most famed of these. Not coincidentally, in Semitic & Sanskrit languages too, the words for Soul are invariably female names. The last great flourishing of Soul worship in western religion was classical gnosticism. Among Gnostics, a central idea was that Sophia (the Mother-goddess Wisdom) spun out from herself, without need of a consort, the whole of the life-force of the world, diminishing herself to become infused into the material world, the energizing power of all life. Such belief remains current in India among saktists or Kali worshippers.

NarcissusSo the diminished Echo is still really that earlier Creatrix trying to call out to humanity, to Narcissus, striving to correct the Error of Sophia & liberate us from the world of Matter by calling us back into the pre-created universe of light & unity. But because she is fused to us, we can never quite perceive Her as anything but a reflection of ourselves, an echo of our own voices, & we are undone by our own vanity & remain snared in the material realm.

Pliny disbelieved that the name Narcissus was derived from whom he called "the fabulous boy," but thought the name originated in the Latin narce (Greek narkao), meaning "benumbed," the same as the root word of Narcotic. But since "the fabulous boy" was himself benumbed, gazing forever languid at his own reflection, Pliny's distinction was a bit fatuous.

That a narcotic that can be extracted from narcissus bulbs is probably the reason some said Narcissus was sired by the eternally benumbed Endymion who dwelt in a cavern of the moon. This drugged state of benumbment permitted the dreamer to experience a place halfway between Life & Death where communion between Matter & Spirit becomes possible, where Eros can speak to Psyche, where Narcissus can commune with his own soul in the deepest of self-reflections. In Kabbalah (an ancient oral tradition like that of the secret wisdom of Echo) there is an idea that Malkhuth, the Lower Shekhinah or female principle of the sephiroth tree, is like a concave mirror in which the enormity of the Universe, the entirety of God, is reflected in miniature, as in a pool or in the bottom of a well. That which is too large to be seen by gazing outward into the overwhelming cosmos can be discovered writ small within, by looking inside oneself, for in each of us is a miniature of the Whole. Something of this can be extended to Echo who calls to us from within, as a small & therefore more easily perceivable reflection of the Absolute.

Narcissus as fertility daemon was the son of the River-god Cephissus ("Garden") & of the bog-lily nymph Leiriope. That he was the son of the Garden indicates how long domesticated his flower has been; that his mother was a bog lily furthers his affinity for the sacred & reflective pool, & with nymphs likewise transformed into flowers. His alternate parentage is no less evocative. His father was the eternally sedated Endymion, & his mother was the sexually aggressive Moon-goddess Selene, who kept the Endymion as her comatose lover. Some would have it that Semele was the mother also of Dionysios, in whose mythology the nymph Echo occurs separately from her association with Narcissus.

When Narcissus was born, his mother Leiriope consulted an oracle, who told her, "Your son will live a very long life so long as he never masturbates." He grew up incapable of relations with the opposite sex, absorbed in his own beauty. All such gods & demigods from Attis to Dionysus have a homosexual history, & Narcissus was courted by Apollo, & by the River-god Ameinius. As it turned out, Narcissus not only rejected all women, but was also incapable of relations with men, & sent Ameinius a sword which for all intent & purpose meant "Go kill yourself." Ameinius did so; he committed suicide on the doorstep of the house of Narcissus. Upon his last breath he called out to Artemis to avenge him against the heartless youth. In some Latin versions, it was Venus (Aphrodite) who cursed Narcissus because of his offensiveness in the face of romantic love."

[erosinvirgo]

Thank you both, I have now another view of that asteroid. I was limiting the meaning on unrequited love, romantic thoughts without an echo etc... but I think it's no such thing yet.
I have it on 16 pisces in natal and conjoint the name town where I live and so actually conjoint with nn and uranus... It's hard to point out exactly what it means for me. I hope perhaps uranus could light a bit of it soon

Thank you both for the responds.

[AquarianEssence]

So the node is transiting natal echo when you discover it? And you're doing your nodal return? Cool. What does the town name mean? That may give you more insight. I always think of an echo as sound waves reaching out into eternity. They don't ever end, do they? And wouldn't thought waves be the same? Light waves go on and one. It takes a certain amount of time for the Sun's light to reach us and even longer for those waves to reach Mars. Hmmm. That means by the time we receive illumination it's old news

[erosinvirgo]

Thanks fot this Neon A, I finally think you're wright, after spending much time analysing it in mine and other persons I know very well. A person whose sun's exact on my echo was a great revelation, I simply do not exist for her (she a woman and for anecdot she "stole" my man) That story was a very interresting "case" to examine this asteroid and also other asteroids and the complete charts of course, but especially echo in all the persons in relation (the 3 echos have meaningfull positions). So for me it seems to be what you said. My words are not very "choosen" or "adequate", I'm french.

Take care

[erosinvirgo]

Thanks Aqua... as you ca n read my respond to Neon A, echo conjunct the town where I live is also meaningfull in that story because this town "weakens" more my position but only in that story not in general, well I don't know perhaps it could also generally weaken it later !? Futur will tell

Take care

[Neon Artemis]

I'm glad you got some kind of benefit out of what I said, sometimes I am very relunctant to say anything or contribute - but I am working on it!

[glaucus]

I have a different take about Echo.

I think Echo has to do with speech and hearing which are connected.
Deaf tend to have problems with speech.
People with auditory processing disorders tend to have problems with speech.
Echo can be the repeating of sounds which were processing through the ears/


Echo could relate to receptive,expressive oral language


I have a history of Dyslexia that was caught when I was 4 years old.
My mother was asked by the nuns what language that I spoke. I ended up getting my speech and hearing tested. They told my mother that I wasn't hearing things right. They told her that I was turning stuff around when I heard it...auditory reversals. They told her that people need to slow down when talking to me. They told her that it was a form of Dyslexia. That's auditory dyslexia and it often gets called Auditory processing Disorder. A majority of Dyslexics have auditory,phonological processing issues. I had auditory therapy,speech therapy,and phonics training to correct my Auditory Dyslexia. I still have problems remembering what people say because I have borderline impaired immediate verbal memory. I can get easily confused by my ears trying to take in too much information for my brain to process.


My Echo in 1'41 Pisces in 6th
square My Neptune in 1'48 Sagittarius in 3rd
conjunct My Moon in 3'11 Pisces
quincunx my 3rd house ruler Pluto in 0'51 Libra in 1st





according to International Dyslexia Association:
www.interdys.org/


Here are some of the symptoms that pertain to auditory
processing,phonological processing


Difficulty with oral language
Late in learning to talk
Difficulty pronouncing words
Difficulty acquiring vocabulary or using age appropriate grammar
Difficulty following directions
Confusion with before/after, right/left, and so on
Difficulty learning the alphabet, nursery rhymes, or songs
Difficulty understanding concepts and relationships
Difficulty with word retrieval or naming problems

Difficulty with reading
Difficulty learning to read
Difficulty identifying or generating rhyming words, or counting
syllables in words (Phonological Awareness)
Difficulty with hearing and manipulating sounds in words (Phonemic
Awareness)
Difficulty distinguishing different sounds in words (Auditory
Discrimination)

[Aphrodite]

Your interpretation strikes a chord with me. In fact, I think I will add Echo to my asteroid study list. If you don't mind, may I ask some questions?

How is Mercury involved in your chart? Have you looked into the effect of Echo transits or progressions? Are there other aspects to Echo in your chart, natally or by long term transit or progression, that aid or hinder you? What other energies are in your chart for you to exploit?

Many years back, I remember watching an interview with Carly Simon on TV. She related that she stuttered so badly as a child that she didn't like to speak at all. Her mother would encourage her, "Just sing it, Carly!" So she began to sing. Now we all have the joy of Carly's beautiful voice because it was once the only way that she could speak. It would be great to look into her chart to see how she uses her energies.

Speaking of music, I recently heard of a study of children that demonstrated significant improvements in math scores for those involved in music. I wonder why that is?

[glaucus]

My Mercury is in Scorpio in 3rd house
conjunct Venus in Scorpio in 3rd
wide square Mars in Aquarius in 6th
biquintile Eris retrograde in Aries in 8th
parallel Venus
parallel Neptune
contraparallel Saturn
conjunct Sun/Neptune midpoint


I haven't looked at Echo in regards to transits,progressions,nor solar arcs.

There are no other planet aspects to Echo.

Sun in Scorpio in 2nd trine Moon in Pisces in 6th seems like a configuration that indicates the luck of me getting my early intervention as well as my willpower,determination to learn special education therapies and to be a normal student.......I was mainstreamed 4 years earlier than predicted.


Singing,music is rightbrained like speech,language is leftbrained.

I used my rightbrained strengths to compensate for my leftbrained weaknesses like other Dyslexics.