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Post by digitalchi on Jul 13, 2006 21:32:10 GMT
Trawling the web, I've found the following descriptions of midpoints from a synastry point of view: - Su/Mo - The inner marriage of yin & yang. At-oneness with self.
- Su/MC - The perceived goal or object of life. Individuality. Father image.
- Mo/MC - How one nurtures oneself and the world. Mother image.
- ASC/MC - Expressing our image very powerfully in the world.
- Su/ASC - Sense of self confidence and creativity.
- Ve/Ma - Passion, sexual drive. Desire. "Carnal juices".
- Su/Ma - Essence of masculinity. Action, aggressiveness. "Ideal man"
- Mo/Ve - Essence of femininity. Devotion, tenderness, gentleness. "Ideal woman"
- Ve/MC - "The Romantic Ideal." Very strong attraction.
- Ve/Vx - Compulsive, powerful feelings of physical attraction.
- Pl/Vx - A deeply transformative/destructive, obsessive encounter. Possible cruelty, or emotional manipulation. Karmic.
- Node/Vx - Similar to the above, but without the manipulative element. A feeling of having known each other before. Inescapable associations. Fateful unions.
- And of course Eros/Psyche from Kim's site: Desire to merge, sexual energy is intense, deep and emotive. Transformation whether taboo or not.
Favourites?
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Post by Kim Falconer on Jul 14, 2006 21:56:28 GMT
Thank you for this list, digitalchi, I am not sure it is a favourite consciously, but in the last few years I have attracted an disproportional number of men (mostly friends but some 'more than') who have the Moon at 4 degrees of Aries. That's my su/Mo midpoint! (and my Amor)....of course my su/mo midpoint with them in synastry is all different, but the mo/mo midpoint (the composite moon) is always the same! (7 Pisces)...what are the odds? And more importantly, what part of me, or them, 'knows' about these contacts and seeks them out? After all these years, it still boggles my mind. Kim
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Post by lubenica on Jul 19, 2006 19:12:08 GMT
I have almost all of those listed with someone, so it is hard to know which one is "the favourite". I would say the most immediately felt one was probably VE=VE/MA (direct midpoint), and MA=MO/VE
There is also Ch=VE/VX and Eros=PL/VX Lots of Nodal connections also, interesting one his north NO=NO/VX, NO=ASC/MO, PL=VE/NO, NO=Eros/Psyche
But I personally find it hard to differentiate the feeling that midpoint connection brings compared to the "full" aspects. For instance, we have exact Venus Mars opposition in synastry, and it also happens that my VE makes a direct hit to his VE/MA midpoint (I use max 1 degree orb for midpoints). So, how am I to know if what I am feeling (and it is the hottest attraction ever) is due to Ve/Ma opposition, or the fact that it is also the midpoint hit, or probably both? Hmmm, do midpoints make it stronger, or does one override the other? Don't know, as I only look at the midpoints as an addition to the synastry aspects, not as having huge meaning in themselves, but perhaps I am wrong....
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Post by whiteheather on Jul 20, 2006 15:50:39 GMT
That's an interesting question, and I don't know the answer to it, but it seems these midpoints are at least as important as a "full" aspect. I realized this when I finally sat down and did the work - and it is very time-consuming - to do the midpoints, yes, with the midpoint calculator, but still, it takes time - but the way I did it was in the reverse. I went through the most comprehensive list of midpoints I have found so far, at www.cafeastrology.com/astrologytopics/meaningsofmidpoints.html, and without knowing if the person in question had those midpoints I picked out certain things that I felt intuitively are at play in our relationship, and only THEN did I calculate the midpoints. I must say it was "BINGO!" every single time. The midpoint was always making a close conjunction to one of my planets, and I can see how that played out. It is, I think, perhaps more subtle than a direct aspect that involves two planets? Or maybe even the midpoint person is reacting to that planet's aspect, rather than the influence going both ways? Has anyone else experienced midpoints in a strong or surprisingly accurate way when there were no obvious planetary influences at work? WH
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Post by Kim Falconer on Jul 21, 2006 21:53:05 GMT
Hi WH,
Oh yes! I have found that midpoints, once checked, can reveal surprising connections that would be perhaps missed if only the planetary aspects are noted. They are time consuming to work with, as you say, mainly because there are so many (or if you don't have an astrology program) but well worth the effort when looking for deeper meaning or fine tuning. The transits to midpoints are equally interesting as the synastry.
Thanks for the link. Maybe you could post it in the resources thread at some point. That site has a wealth of information.
Midpoints can help us understand the meaning of planets when they are linked to each other by aspect as well. For example, if you have a conjunction in the natal chart, subjectively it can be difficult sometimes to really understand which planet feels like 'what' because you don't experience them in isolation. They are merged...studying the midpoint, which may be within a degree or so of both and will be activated by transit, progression or synastry at the same time, can really bring some insights.
Thanks again for the link!
Warmly, Kim
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Post by grenadine on Jul 21, 2006 23:40:12 GMT
ASTROWIN (a free astrology software by Allen Edwall) calculates all midpoints for you, both in natal chart and in synastry. And so much more. Awesome software! www.astrowin.org/astrowin.htm
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Post by jamma on Jul 22, 2006 19:15:52 GMT
Thanks for posting that list, Digi ... because they are "invisible," I sometimes forget to even check them But with your list in hand, I was inspired to compare my mps with those of MM ... There were some interesting contacts (my Sappho conjunct his Sun-Moon midpoint is kinda nice ) ... But what really intrigued me were the "shared degrees" of our midpoints ... not always in the same signs, but out of the 13 mps on the list, 9 of mine and 9 of his are at the same degree (less than 1-degree orb) as the other's ... for example, my Su/Mo at 11 Pisces and NN/Vtx at 11 Cancer; his Mo/Ve at 11 Scorpio ... And if you consider both the near and far mps, you get all kinds of trines, sextiles, oppositions and squares ... wish there were a way to print out a midpoint synastry chart (if I get ambitious, maybe I'll hand-draw one) ... However, before I get in too deep, I need to know if midpoints can even be looked at this way ... been doing my own web-trawling for a discussion of midpoint to midpoint synastry, but no luck so far ... Anybody got a link? opinion? intuition? Thanks, J
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Post by Kim Falconer on Jul 24, 2006 22:01:41 GMT
Hi Jamma, We can keep slicing the pie into more and more fractions. Of course, at some point everything will be connected to everything (which may be just how it is!)...though for our study, it makes it quite tricky. I don't think we are quite 'there' yet. I would avoid looking at midpoints of composite charts, because they are already midpoint charts. You can do a kind of synastry as you describe, especially using the 90 degree dial. This is where you will find actual degrees (particularly of signs in the same modality) become very important. Are you familiar with this Uranian technique? Ebertin's written extensively on it. Let me find a link. finblake.home.mindspring.com/bf90dialexplan.htmSomething to sink your teeth into! ;D Kim
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Post by jamma on Jul 25, 2006 6:21:40 GMT
Thanks, Kim ... I appreciate the info and am intrigued by "the dials" ... although it's not likely I'll get my teeth into anything for a couple of days ... just had a wisdom tooth pulled and am on soft foods at the moment! That sounds so right -- just how it is... I have an image of the interconnectedness of everyone (and everything) as an endless explanse of fabric that appears to be one color, say brown, until you look closer and then see little flecks of red, yellow, blue, green, purple sprinkled throughout ... The larger, brighter nubs are the major planets, points, etc. The midpoints are specks, too -- perhaps in less obvious colors but still forming an important part of the structure that holds the material together ... Individually, the arrangement and frequency of the specks will vary according to the placements in our charts, but we are still "cut from the same cloth" ... Whoa, never realized pain pills could make one wax philosophical ... hope this will still make sense in the morning! ... xxoxx, jam
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Post by gemstar on Jul 25, 2006 11:40:15 GMT
Feel better Jamma! Your written visual was lovely!
Kim makes a great point...nearly everything will end up being connected by the time you break everything down into little threads of connection. Discovering the main themes within astrology still seems to mean the most. Fine-tuning is fun though there are many people who hold onto interpretations from the little guys as weight over the more important aspects-especially in synastry!! Trying to glimmer some hope when the glaring bigger planets are simply sitting quiet. (Meaning-not connected by a whole lot of strong aspects for that couple).
Where do we sort of draw the line Kim? It is too easy to keep slicing and dicing to find more connections. It is no different than filling your chart full of asteroids and then only to discover each millimeter is packed with something or other!! When is searching too deeply too much (or redundant)?
Hugs- GemStar
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Post by Kim Falconer on Jul 25, 2006 22:24:50 GMT
Yes, if you plot all the asteroids, the chart is filled in (over 10,000) and nothing is readable...unless you draw a horoscope the size of a tennis court! I think you can let practicality be your guide. In reading for a client, you are only going to spend a few hours once a year or less delving into their charts and you are going to be able to give them PLENTY to think about! In working on your own synastries, there is more time to delve and the research is interesting though you can get a 'forest-trees' syndrome happening! You need some guidelines to stay on track...some breadcrumbs! You mention redundancy and here is where we get the rule of Three. In horary, we look for three confirming aspects and in these deeper searches, we can see where more intricate connections mirror or support major aspects. For example, you might have Neptune in the 4th, Dionysus in Cancer and your Mo/Ne midpoint conjunct Ceres! These all create a resonance that reinforces a particular theme and when someone else's 'something' contacts it, WHAM it wakes up! Other times it will conflict...Sometimes Neptune in the 4th is conjunct their Mars! A whole new energy comes in...and then asteroid Jason might be in Sag in the 10th on the Uranus-Jupiter midpoint and conjunct the Draconic Neptune....and THEIR name is Jason and a new theme appears! It's like living in a myth! I think we need to draw the line when we start to spin out...and that can be at a different 'place' for all of us at any given time!!! Kim
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Post by Juliet on Jul 25, 2006 23:39:04 GMT
Dear all, I find that when I follow my intuition, I always use (for me) meaningful midpoints/ asteroids. The ones I use are not devided evenly in my charts, always in small clusters, patterns.
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Post by gemstar on Jul 25, 2006 23:56:30 GMT
I agree that using your practical sense and intuition is the way to go. There are so many asteroids that it can make your head spin! On occasion, I see posts where too many esoteric asteroids are listed in synastry and it feels like those people are reaching for something....something to 'hold onto' if none of the traditional big planets' synastrical aspects please them.
Choosing a few of the more meaningful asteroids for yourself seems like a clean measure. Themes from the main planets are usually echoed by the asteroids so I believe the thought of redundancy makes sense! Looking for the main themes and then fine tuning them with midpoints is a wonderful way to bring things together!
Hugs- GemStar
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Post by samina on Jul 27, 2006 13:35:14 GMT
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norain
Junior Member
Posts: 26
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Post by norain on Oct 4, 2009 23:15:15 GMT
Doing midpoint research here. but... I find all the women I have lived with have either Venus or the Moon at 0 degree Sag. That isn't in my midpoints table. So what is that point? Why would they ALL have it? Must be important. -Del
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